- Re: Avoiding widows/orphans in MSIE
- Posted by James Taylor on July 3rd, 2003
In article <oprrofwiuht9vwg0@localhost>,
Matthew Somerville <matthew.somerville@trinity.oxford.ac.uk> wrote:
I really wish you hadn't included my real unmodified email address in
a public forum such as this. I go to great lengths to avoid spammers
picking up my address and you've just blown all my hard work. :-(
Strangely, I didn't get your CC'd email at all.
Yes, I saw it, and it was helpful, thanks. However, as far as
I could tell, it did not attempt to answer the precise question
which Molly quoted, so I was correct to say "nobody else has
attempted to answer that question".
Looks simple but perfectly pleasant and eminently accessible.
I wouldn't be quite that derogatory myself. :-)
But surely, if the stylistic markup in the HTML is treated no differently
than a base level CSS stylesheet (as ought to be the case), then there
shouldn't be any harm done by including such markup for the benefit of
pre-CSS browsers. That's the point I was trying to make.
So it seems you agree, at least in practise even if not in theory. ;-)
Really? Can you educate me as to how exactly?
Hey, don't take it personally. I hadn't seen your site. I was just
hand-waving at the general attitude I get from a certain kind of
web deeziner. I'm sure there are no such people diligent enough
to read this group, least of all you Matthew.
--
James Taylor, Cheltenham, Gloucestershire, UK. PGP key: 3FBE1BF9
To protect against spam, the address in the "From:" header is not valid.
In any case, you should reply to the group so that everyone can benefit.
If you must send me a private email, use james at oakseed demon co uk.
- Posted by Matthew Somerville on July 3rd, 2003
On Thu, 3 Jul 2003 21:59:51 +0100, James Taylor <spam-block-@-SEE-MY-
SIG.com> wrote:
Sorry. It's not a header picked up by XOVER, so I think you'll be okay. And
a Google (web or groups) for your email address shows it's already out
there...
Strange indeed.
Yes, it would be good if it were as you said; unfortunately I think HTML
stylistic markup outranks any style sheet. :-/ One (slight) mitigating
factor is it would then involve keeping two 'copies' of the style up to
date - one would soon fall behind. And if you were doing it "properly", as
it were, you wouldn't be able to use tables for layout in your HTML, so
what stylistic markup is left? Changing font colour with <font> - see below
for why that's bad.
Yep. Putting colours on <body> is perfectly harmless as far as I can
tell, so it's there.
http://www.mcsr.olemiss.edu/~mudws/font.html says it best, I think. And
ISTR pages in Oregano that were unreadable because of some combination of
bgcolor and a style sheet.
Don't worry, I didn't. :-)
I've only got time now I've finished my degree. ;-)
ATB,
Matthew
--
matthew.somerville@trinity.oxford.ac.uk - http://www.dracos.co.uk/
- Posted by James Taylor on July 4th, 2003
In article <oprrralqyit9vwg0@localhost>,
Matthew Somerville <matthew.somerville@trinity.oxford.ac.uk> wrote:
I've not heard of XOVER. What is it?
Anyway, I thought spammers simply ran a regular scan of their
news spool matching anything that looked like an email address.
A simple approach like that would pick up any email address
regardless of which header it appeared in.
Oh bugger. :-( No wonder I'm getting such a glut of spam at the
moment. I think it's time I retired this Demon hostname and set
myself up with an entirely new account. Pity, though, because I've
had this address for many years and built a good reputation on it.
Well... a reputation anyway. ;-)
Thanks for the other info. Have you any idea why MSIE 6.0 is
ignoring markup like?:
<div style="page-break-inside: avoid">
<h1 style="page-break-after: avoid">Main heading</h1>
<h2 style="page-break-after: avoid">Subheading</h2>
<p>Paragraph of body text. Blah, blah, blah...</p>
</div>
It just page breaks wherever it feels like, leaving headings at
the bottom of pages, and images missing their bottom half. Images
also lose their left/right alignment so that they are centred with
text flow being squeezed around the narrow side. It looks appalling.
MSIE does obey "page-break-before: always" but I don't want to have
to set page breaks manually like that. MSIE should obey my <div>
wrappers and automatically chose a suitable point between each
<div> where to page-break depending on the particular printer
margins in force at the time. Is there something extra I need to
do to get this to work correctly?
--
James Taylor, Cheltenham, Gloucestershire, UK. PGP key: 3FBE1BF9
To protect against spam, the address in the "From:" header is not valid.
In any case, you should reply to the group so that everyone can benefit.
If you must send me a private email, use james at oakseed demon co uk.
- Posted by Matthew Somerville on July 4th, 2003
On Fri, 4 Jul 2003 00:48:01 +0100, James Taylor <spam-block-@-SEE-MY-
SIG.com> wrote:
It returns only a few headers of the news spool (including From: but not
Reply-To:, which is why quite a few people put their real email address in
Reply-To and none of the body; it appears most (all?) spammers use this
rather than the whole news spool, as that would be far too large.
I see you're using Marcel - can't you install something like AntiSpam or
SpamStamp? I don't know if they work on their own, or have to use something
like POPstar, which anyway I think you might be able to use with Marcel?
Same here; now I've finished University, this address is going to be
deleted in a few months - I'm actually looking forward to the spam dropping
(at least for a few days :-) ).
Yes, IE6 does not appear to support page-break-inside at all, nor page-
break-before or page-break-after with a value of 'avoid'...
When I was trying printing from IE, I even had images splitting across a
page and printing over text; very annoying.
Hmm, not sure about that one, never had it myself, but wouldn't be
surprised.
Install a proper browser?
Certainly, Opera supports these commands; I
still don't know if it will be as perfect as you want, but it's certainly
much better.
ATB,
Matthew
--
matthew.somerville@trinity.oxford.ac.uk - http://www.trinity.ox.ac.uk/jcr/
- Posted by James Taylor on July 4th, 2003
In article <oprrr3ergot9vwg0@localhost>,
Matthew Somerville <matthew.somerville@trinity.oxford.ac.uk> wrote:
Yes, I suppose I could but I don't even want to have to download
the spam in the first place. Just as soon as I've finished this
current project I'm going to use some server space I have with
a scriptable QMail system in order to implement my own solution.
The beauty of it will be that I won't have to do any heuristic
filtering, which would be a maintenance nightmare. I can't wait! :-P
:-)
Does MSIE do *anything* useful?! I despair at the lemming-like stupidity of
people trying to run their businesses on Microsoft software. Whenever I go
into my clients' offices I seem to see people struggling with some fault or
grotesque over complexity, and I wonder what possesses them to use Microsoft
in the first place. If they chucked it all out and got almost any other
system they'd save money in months by avoiding all that lost productivity.
You jest, but I think that's the only practical solution.
I'll advise them to install it. Does the free version print with
or without the advertisements?
Have y'all a good weekend. I'm of until Monday...
--
James Taylor, Cheltenham, Gloucestershire, UK. PGP key: 3FBE1BF9
To protect against spam, the address in the "From:" header is not valid.
In any case, you should reply to the group so that everyone can benefit.
If you must send me a private email, use james at oakseed demon co uk.
